orichalcum: (teacher)
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Because [livejournal.com profile] meepodeekin asked, and because, unlike _every other Roman history professor_ I've met or worked with, I would like to figure out a way to explain this coherently and concisely, here's my working explanation of how Roman elections worked. Suggestions for improvement in clarity are welcome; I have yet to find a good diagram.



Initial Crucial Facts:

1. The Roman voting system wasn't formally designed; it evolved organically, partially out of military divisions of people and partially out of geographical divisions.
2. It treads a narrow line between giving all adult Roman male citizens a vote and keeping the actual power in the hands of the rich and aristocratic.
3. Different electoral offices were elected by different systems.

System A: Comitia Centuriata (elects the major and most powerful magistrates every year)

The Roman voting population (adult male citizens who make it to Rome for Election Day) is divided up into 193 "centuries," originally military units, now on the basis of wealth (not income), which is assessed every 10 years, at least theoretically. Each century votes internally for a candidate; the majority vote determines who the favored candidate of that century will be on Ballot #1.

Important: The centuries do _not_ have an equal number of citizens in them.

They are divided into Six Classes, on the basis of wealth, more or less.

First Class:
Centuries #1-9, containing ~400 men each: Men over 46 owning more than ~$5 million. = 9 votes. (senators and equites)
Centuries #10-18, probably about 700 men each: Men 17-46 owning more than ~$5 million = 9 votes. (senators and equites)
Centuries #19- 98, maybe 5000 men each: Men owning more than ~$320K, divided into equal centuries (40) of older and younger men 17-46 = 80 votes.

Second Class: 20 centuries, lower wealth requirement, 10 centuries of over-46 men and 10 of under-46 = 20 votes
Third Class: 20 centuries, lower wealth requirement, 10 centuries of over-46 men and 10 of under-46 = 20 votes
Fourth Class: 20 centuries, lower wealth requirement, 10 centuries of over-46 men and 10 of under-46 = 20 votes
Fifth Class: 30 centuries, (15 of each age category) men owning more than $38K...= 30 votes
Army engineers and musicians: 4 centuries = 4 votes
Capite censi (proletarii): 1 century of every man owning less than $38K (probably 85% of the voting population, at least, maybe at the height of the Republic 200,000 people): 1 vote.
Total Votes: 193

Each century votes in turn, and the voting stops as soon as a majority _of centuries_, 97 of them, has chosen the same candidate. In other words, if the entire First Class votes for the same candidate, then he wins, and the 2nd-6th Classes never get asked for their opinion. In order for the bottom 85% of the population by wealth to get to vote at all, everybody richer than they are has to have split evenly in their votes, and even then, they get one total vote shared among all 200,000 or so of them. Unsurprisingly, most don't bother showing up.

System B: Comitia Tributa (Popular/Plebeian Assembly) elected minor officials (quaestors, aediles, tribunes), passes laws (normally recommended by the Senate).

35 Tribes, originally regionally based, with 4 Urban Tribes and 31 Rural Tribes, majority of 18 required to choose a candidate/pass a law. The Urban Tribes included all freedmen, new Roman citizens, and the urban poor. The Rural Tribes consisted of whoever had the time and desire to come to Rome for an election from their country farm, so it's still dominated by the wealthy elites. As before, you vote within your tribe first, and then each tribe gets one vote. So the 500 or so folks from a rural tribe are equal in power to the 50,000 people living in one of the urban Roman tribes. You maintain your family tribal identity even if you move, so Roman families who have lived in the city for hundreds of years may still vote as a rural tribe member.

My real problem is that I'd love to model this in class, but my sections are only 16 or so kids, and the numbers don't work out right. Even if I make only 11 of them Capite Censi, and give the 2nd-5th classes to four students, that still massively underestimates the power of the 1 student who gets to be the First Class.

I need [livejournal.com profile] fajitas to design a game for me or something. I wonder if I could get a grant for that.
Mood:: 'excited' excited
There are 8 comments on this entry. (Reply.)
 
posted by [identity profile] cerebralpaladin.livejournal.com at 10:43pm on 08/04/2009
It seems to me like you could model the first system tolerably well by having one person represent multiple centuries. So one lucky student gets 10 votes, the next gets 5, the third through eight each get 1, and then the remaining eight students get one vote between them. The net effect is that the vote of the rich "First Class" student matters a great deal, the various intermediate upper class people don't matter much, and then the "Capite Censi" don't matter at all.

If you also slap on Tribe labels, and then mix and match a little, you can model both systems.

It's not perfect, but the point is that by running through it for 5 minutes, you can get the feel. You can then quickly point out the actual numbers, and the fact that your model system underweights the power of the elites, and move on.
 
posted by [identity profile] cerebralpaladin.livejournal.com at 10:45pm on 08/04/2009
Addendum: don't spend too much time on the "stopping counting once a majority is reached" point. That's mostly a red herring-- it points out how crazy the system is, but it doesn't have any dilutive effect on its own. (It does have an effect in suppressing participation, which may be intended to avoid showing the dichotomy between the candidate of the people and the candidate of the elites, but it doesn't change the outcome of any given election. So you want to deal with that in terms of how the optics work, not in terms of the mechanics of the structure.)
 
posted by [identity profile] meepodeekin.livejournal.com at 03:27am on 09/04/2009
That is the best, most awesomest insane voting system I have ever heard. I love it. It's delightful. (In an ironic way, in case you were worried about my democratic cred. :) )

What about modelling it with a computer simulation? Large numbers of little stick figures or even dots sorted according to some reasonable approximation of the numbers? It would probably be a lot of work to get it to look pretty, though.
 
posted by [identity profile] julianyap.livejournal.com at 02:15pm on 09/04/2009
If you think this is insane and awesome, you should see what the Venetian's used to pick their leaders.

Sadly, it is way too complex for me to remember off hand and I can't find it anywhere, but when I get a chance I'll dig out John Norwich's History of Venice and tell you about it.
 
posted by [identity profile] julianyap.livejournal.com at 02:22pm on 09/04/2009
Ah ha! Just showing that everything is on the internet if only you look hard enough. From wikipedia:

New regulations for the elections of the doge introduced in 1268 remained in force until the end of the republic in 1797. Their object was to minimize as far as possible the influence of individual great families, and this was effected by a complex elective machinery. Thirty members of the Great Council, chosen by lot, were reduced by lot to nine; the nine chose forty and the forty were reduced by lot to twelve, who chose twenty-five. The twenty-five were reduced by lot to nine and the nine elected forty-five. Then the forty-five were once more reduced by lot to eleven, and the eleven finally chose the forty-one who actually elected the doge.[1]
 
posted by [identity profile] orichalcum.livejournal.com at 04:33pm on 09/04/2009
Wow, at that point, you can save a whole lot of time by just drawing a name from a hat, I would think. :)

 
posted by [identity profile] meepodeekin.livejournal.com at 06:18pm on 09/04/2009
Gloriously awesome, but kind of stupid. If the lots were honest, that must be close to equivalent to randomly selecting the last eleven, and if they weren't, why bother?
 
posted by [identity profile] marginaleye.livejournal.com at 04:02am on 10/04/2009
I have yet to find a good diagram.

Use rows for the Centuries, and columns for the Tribes.

April

SunMonTueWedThuFriSat
      1 2
 
3 4
 
5
 
6 7 8 9 10 11
 
12 13 14
 
15
 
16 17 18
 
19 20 21 22 23
 
24 25
 
26 27
 
28
 
29
 
30